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Building a Rock Waterfall for Tiki pool area |
sneakyjack
Tiki Socialite
Joined: May 25, 2004
Posts: 1126
From: NYC Area
|  Posted: 2006-06-07 5:54 pm Permalink
So I am interested in creating a rock wall type fountain, possibly with them big clam shell type things in it (any one know where to buy?), but I am wondering the best technique or any hints from people that have made them. I do not necessarily need a "pool" / Pond at the bottom with fish and such because it will be near my swimming pool (in ground). I plan on using real rocks and I have heard to use Black foam (spray type) to secure the rocks. I have also heard about silo liners for the Water area but am thinking about using just a cooler in ground as you won't really be able to get close to it to see where the water is ending up. I do want to light it and I have electricity running to the area. SO what am I asking? Mostly for tips on what to do and not to do or any pics / websites that could help. I am considering having a tiki or Moai on top to start the water - falling. Also the area is about 8 feet by 6 feet. I could also use help for a "fence are to go behind - I'm thinking bambo in en type fence Who can help in my quest? Thanks in advance for any help.
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Lake Surfer
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Oct 21, 2002
Posts: 3414
From: Milwaukee, WI
| Posted: 2006-06-07 10:15 pm Permalink
Just re read that you want a rock wall... that's not what I built... sorry...
But it is a cool little fountain feature for those with limited space...
[ This Message was edited by: Lake Surfer 2006-06-08 21:00 ]
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tikigap
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Jan 19, 2006
Posts: 839
From: Arlingtron Virginia
| Posted: 2006-06-08 06:16 am Permalink
Hey Sneaky!
I would like to see Lake's pictures of this! I want to make one too!
I searched E-Bay for "large clam shell" and got lots of hits. Here's the first one:
Big Clam Shell on E-Bay
[ This Message was edited by: tikigap 2006-06-08 06:21 ]
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tikiwinebear
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Sep 30, 2004
Posts: 582
From: Santa Rosa, CA (Sonoma - wine country)
| Posted: 2006-06-08 08:18 am Permalink
Sounds like a fantastic project, sneakyjack! We also have been entertaining the idea of putting something like this together, but in a smaller scale. I did a little research on giant clam shells, and found that they are not cheap! I got some ideas of materials from this website:
http://www.shellhorizons.com/products.asp?category=69
I haven't actually purchased from them yet, and hear the shipping can be a bit high, but at least if you can find what you want for your project!
Good Luck! Take pictures along the process!
- Myke
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Coco Loco
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Mar 21, 2004
Posts: 820
From: Exotic Isle of Alameda
| Posted: 2006-06-08 09:13 am Permalink
Hey Sneaky,
Oceanic Arts in Southern CA has giant plastic clam shells. They look more realistic than plastic. They're punch bowl size to large enough to sit in. I think they're around $30 - $50 each. http://www.oceanicarts.net. They can most likely ship it out to you.
Sounds like a great project. Would love to see the pictures!
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sneakyjack
Tiki Socialite
Joined: May 25, 2004
Posts: 1126
From: NYC Area
| Posted: 2006-06-08 09:34 am Permalink
Thanks for the quick responses
I didn't think the shells would be cheap - was hoping they would appear cheaper (oh well) by doing it myself it will save $$. I'm hoping to do this this summer but it may spill into NEXT summer - only because of removal of a farge bush where the fountain will go.
thanks again. YES before and after pics will be posted! Keep the help coming! words, links pics too!
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Bamboo Boyd
Tiki Centralite
Joined: Apr 25, 2006
Posts: 37
From: Phoenix, AZ
| Posted: 2006-06-08 09:52 am Permalink
Hi SneakyJack,
Sounds like a great project. I'm a landscape architect so I'll give you a few pointers on the design/construction of the waterfall and hopefully will get you started on the right foot. When we build permanent water features here in Phoenix, we use real boulders so I assume that it will be similar to what we build. Basically start with a few of your larger boulders at the base, we call them pancake boulders because their dimensions are, for example, 2'x 3' 2', or 4'x 3'x2'. Basically you want ones with a flat surface on the top that you can "stack" smaller boulders on around. The key is to get a good solid base. We typically dig a 8"-12" footing for the base of the boulders, use 4" mesh wire set on a a few broken brick pavers to elevate the wire 2"-3" off the ground and then fill the footing with concrete. We fill the footing to within about 3"-4" of the dirt level so that after we place the boulders, we can backfill against them and hide the footing and the bottom few inches of the boulder and make it look more natural.
Once the concrete starts to set up, we place our base boulders in place so that they are set with the tops somewhat level and they won't move on you as you build the rest of the water feature. Once you get the base set, you then add boulders and shape the water feature to your taste. You asked about using a black spray foam to hold the boulders in place. I'm not familiar with that. We use standard mortar and you can buy coloring additives to add to the mortar mix if desired. Check in your yellow pages for any masonry supply store.
As for the pond, you can use just about anything you want. Most people out here dig the pond about 20" deep and to what ever shape they want. Plumb it with PVC pipe for the pump. And then they use the wire mesh and concrete to build the pond and then do a rounded berm edge to make it look a little natural. Almost like a bond beam on a swimming pool. Then after the concrete sets and cures, you can seal it to help prevent leaks, and line it with river rock or whatever you like and then you should be all set. There are a ton of different things you can use for the pond, you can do what you were thinking, or you can get the plastic inserts from home depot or Lowe's. You can also use a rubber liner. The possibilities are endless. Let me know if you have any other questions.
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freddiefreelance
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Feb 15, 2003
Posts: 3006
From: San Diego, Ca.
| Posted: 2006-06-08 09:59 am Permalink
Paging OnaTiki, Ona to thread...
Check out some of the Waterfall images Here:
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Howland
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Jan 30, 2006
Posts: 749
From: Folly Beach, SC--'Follynesia'
| Posted: 2006-06-08 2:10 pm Permalink
Do a google search on "photo props clam". I've found some in the recent past running about 50 bucks for one big enough to hold a small child. I've had a similar project running around in my head for a month or so now, just no time yet to pull it together. Good luck and post some progress pics.
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chisel slinger
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Feb 23, 2004
Posts: 263
From: columbus,ohio
| Posted: 2006-06-08 3:08 pm Permalink
thanks bamboo boyd, you just helped me on my project. now, what do you use to seal/paint the concrete. I want mine black, But I dont want the paint to come right off. thanks. c.s.
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Bamboo Boyd
Tiki Centralite
Joined: Apr 25, 2006
Posts: 37
From: Phoenix, AZ
| Posted: 2006-06-09 1:59 pm Permalink
Chisel, are you talking about the concrete base for the pond? I know I mentioned sealer, but after asking around, most installers said they don't seal the pond basin unless it leaks. If you are going to put fish in it, painting it black could make it hotter and literally "cook" your koi. I've seen it happen. If you aren't going to put fish in it. You could use a coloring additive (see link below), but if it were me, I'd probably go for the more natural look and get a bunch of those black shiny 1-2" pebbles and cover the bottom with that. Out here they call them "black mexican pebbles". You could even "set" them in the wet concrete basin so that they were touching each other, and when the concrete hardens, they are set in place, but that would be pretty time consuming. If you really want a black basin, you might look at the plastic basins at home depot. They are pretty easy to use and camoflauge. Either way would work. I would, however, add a coloring additive to the mortar mix I use to build the waterfeature that matches the boulders so you don't see the grey mortar. The coloring additive you can get at any masonry supply house. Or check with a local pool builder, they might help. Here's a link to the local one here in Phoenix that we use. http://www.cohills.com/main.htm. Open the link, click on "Intrgral colors" and then on color swatches. They don't have a black, but I'm sure if you find something like this locally, they can tell you what colors to mix to get black. Let me know if you have any more questions.
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chisel slinger
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Feb 23, 2004
Posts: 263
From: columbus,ohio
| Posted: 2006-06-10 11:06 am Permalink
thanks!
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Jungle Trader
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Jan 04, 2003
Posts: 3742
From: Trader's Jungle Outpost, Turlock, Ca.
| Posted: 2006-06-10 3:41 pm Permalink
All you need is a shovel, 45 mil liner, pump, 2 inch pipe for large waterfall, filter, rocks and plants. You don't need mortar, concrete or gunite. Take a look at my website and you'll see some of the stuff I've done. The Abigail pond is my backyard. For me, I love it when it looks natural. You can't get that with mortar, cuz you can't plant between the rocks. Without plants it's too stark and unrealistic. Plants tend to soften the look. For the filter I just use a 55 gal. drum and fill it with lava rock. If you have koi, you'll want a UV light, but if it's just goldfish, don't worry about it. Algae Fix is also a must for clearing of pea soup algae. Create bogs or steps and you can set plants down in the pond. Shade is also a must to prevent string algae, otherwise you'll fight it during the hot summer.
Oh yeah, don't put rock at the bottom. Unless you get a muck vac. It's just harder to get to the debris with rock. When debris sinks to the bottom, it tries to decompose but it can't. If it stays there it will eventually cause your pond to "crash". It might take 2 years or 5 but it will crash, and kill everything in it. With no rock the debris won't get stuck between the rocks. Some algae is good for the pond and it will eventually cover the liner so it's less visible.
Another oh yeah, I also use the black foam in a can. Spray it between rocks, it expands 3 times the size of the original bead and seals cracks so the water flows over the tops of the rocks and not underneath. Once it has dried, after about 1 hr., you can cut out or tear off any excess.
Good luck!
[ This Message was edited by: Jungle Trader 2006-06-10 21:14 ]
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RevBambooBen
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Nov 12, 2002
Posts: 7784
From: Huntikington Beach
| Posted: 2006-06-11 09:31 am Permalink
So......
How do I build a waterfall the re-circulates into my portable spa?
The Gut's Parts/ pump tubing, etc. Not the shell, exterior, part.
[ This Message was edited by: RevBambooBen 2006-06-11 09:33 ]
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Jungle Trader
Tiki Socialite
Joined: Jan 04, 2003
Posts: 3742
From: Trader's Jungle Outpost, Turlock, Ca.
| Posted: 2006-06-11 5:46 pm Permalink
Quote:
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On 2006-06-11 09:31, RevBambooBen wrote:
So......
How do I build a waterfall the re-circulates into my portable spa?
The Gut's Parts/ pump tubing, etc. Not the shell, exterior, part.
[ This Message was edited by: RevBambooBen 2006-06-11 09:33 ]
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You don't, you scurvy dog.
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