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Tiki Central Forums Beyond Tiki Ashlee Simpson: the fake exposed !!
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Ashlee Simpson: the fake exposed !!
Tikiwahine
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Joined: Apr 09, 2003
Posts: 3293
From: Victoria, BC
Posted: 2004-10-25 1:32 pm   Permalink

That's hilarious!

The fist link didn't work for me, here's another one from the site Tangaroa mentions above:

http://lipsync.us.nyud.net:8090/ashlee_snl_big.mpg
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tikibars
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Joined: Apr 11, 2002
Posts: 2025
From: Aku Hall, Chicago
Posted: 2004-10-25 1:54 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2004-10-25 12:44, hanford_lemoore wrote:
a lot of the newsarticles have been saying this:

Quote:
However, the recording sounded a lot like a guide vocal track--a commonly used, though little-discussed, aid performers employ in concert, either to make their voices sound stronger, as they sing with the track, or to cover their voices entirely, as they lip-synch to the track.



But I ask the experts of Tiki Central: are "guide vocal tracks" real? This sounds like a fake answer ... how can a background vocal make your voice sound strnoger? Wouldn't a second voice track make it sound like 2 people were singing?



If you listen carefully to a LOT of music, the vocals are double-tracked. The singer sings the song once, and then sings it again to get a 'bigger' and more rich sound. They do this with guitars too.

If the same person is singing the same song twice-over, then two things can happen:

1.
If it is done badly, it sounds like two people are singing.

2.
If it is done well, by a quality singer who can listen back to his/her previous performance and duplicate it almost precisely, then it gives the appearance of a single vocal, but with a richer and bigger quality to it.

This technique goes back to the 60s, and EVERYONE does it, save for (essentailly) acousticy-folky types and jazzers. Yes, your favorite punk bands and 'real' muscians do this too.

And, of course, there are digital techniques that can be used these days to make the second vocal (or "double") line up a little closer to the original if it isn't spot-on.

Like I said, they also double the guitars on, basically, every rock record made since the middle 1960s to make them more huge, and they do it on other instruments too.

Now the other problem is how you pull it off live.

Some people just blow off the doubling effect live, letting the excitement and energy of the show (and sometimes sheer volume) make up for the lost production techniques.

Others play (or sing) along to tapes, with one track on the tape mixed with a live sing-a-long (or play-a-long) from the stage.



[ This Message was edited by: tikibars on 2004-10-25 13:56 ]


 
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MachTiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Posts: 1368
From: San Diego, CA
Posted: 2004-10-25 1:57 pm   Permalink

Okay, so they're blaming the drummer for starting the wrong song. Nice try. Who's to blame for the fact that Ashlee Simpson couldn't sing, so (instead of finding another band to fill in) nobody saw anything wrong with her just lip-synching?!

BFD if the drummer starts the wrong song - IF everyone involved is on the up-and-up!. "Whoops, I started the wrong intro. Better get back on track or start the whole song over again". And if you do start over again, you look bad for a second - then everything is cool again.

Bottom line: The entire thing was a hoax. Whether it's the first time or the 1,000. They tried to fool the public and got caught!
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donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2004-10-25 2:11 pm   Permalink

Bottom line is Ashlee sucks, but she's not the only one. Take your pick of the other 'artists' out there. This is a reach but the only one I've seen that posesses any real vocal talent is actually Jessica Simpson. Don't get me wrong, I am in no way shape or form a fan of hers, but compared to the other 'divas', she can project. Even somebody like Christina Aguilera looks like she's faking it. They get that forced vibrato in their voice and bobble their heads up and down real fast while they're holding the long notes and all of the sudden they're 'great singers'? Please...you know who's a great singer? Joan Jett!!! Yeah baby ...whooo!!!


[ This Message was edited by: donhonyc on 2004-10-25 14:15 ]


 
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tikibars
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Apr 11, 2002
Posts: 2025
From: Aku Hall, Chicago
Posted: 2004-10-25 2:22 pm   Permalink

All you have to do is look at the guitars and keyboards and things.

Half of the time they aren't even plugged in.

Look for microphones on the drums and in front of the guitar amps.

No mics on the instruments = lip sync!

In the defense of many of these artists, sometimes it just isn't feasible to set up their live show for a TV appearance, and sometimes there are contractual issues preventing the live performance. Lip-syncing is a loophole in those cases. On a show like the Grammys or something, where there are 20 artists playing in a row... there's no way to make that happen if they're all live.

....and true enough, some of them just suck - manipulated to a high degree in the studio, and lip-syncing to pull it off live!

Remembr that 90% (actual statistic) off all music is sold to people under 22. These kids aren't as sophisicated as us adults like to think we are. You can sell 'em a pop package of studio-manipulated music and a lip-sync show, and they'll think it's the greatest thing ever. Yes, clearly the DO, because it is selling to SOMEONE.

When I was a kid, I listened to the Clash and the Buzzcocks (who's records ARE doctored to some degree), but a lot of my peers bought into super-pop stuff like Madonna, and Duran Duran, and the Thompson Twins, and Cyndi Lauper... that stuff is just as phony as what is going on now, and it sold like mad in it's day.


 
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Sam Gambino
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Joined: Dec 02, 2003
Posts: 2199
From: www.samgambino.com
Posted: 2004-10-25 2:35 pm   Permalink

Say what you will, but in my opinion, it just doesn't get much better than a Stones tune with Keith Richards on lead vocal - even his ballads are great.

"All About You"
"Slipping Away"
"I Wanna Hold You"
"Losing My Touch"
"Before They Make Me Run"
"Little T&A"
"Happy"

...and his solo stuff like "Eileen" and "Struggle".
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[ This Message was edited by: Sam Gambino on 2004-10-25 14:38 ]


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cynfulcynner
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Joined: Mar 24, 2002
Posts: 1799
From: Ocean Beach, San Francisco
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:01 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2004-10-25 14:22, tikibars wrote:
a lot of my peers bought into super-pop stuff like Madonna, and Duran Duran, and the Thompson Twins, and Cyndi Lauper... that stuff is just as phony as what is going on now, and it sold like mad in it's day.



I've seen Duran Duran twice (in 1984 and last year) and I can assure you that Simon was most definitely NOT lip-syncing!



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[ This Message was edited by: cynfulcynner on 2004-10-25 15:01 ]


 
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donhonyc
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:14 pm   Permalink

Quote:

When I was a kid, I listened to the Clash and the Buzzcocks (who's records ARE doctored to some degree), but a lot of my peers bought into super-pop stuff like Madonna, and Duran Duran, and the Thompson Twins, and Cyndi Lauper... that stuff is just as phony as what is going on now, and it sold like mad in it's day.



I'm no music-tech but Madonna? Definitely manipulated in production. And probably some on Duran and Thompson Twins to a certain extent. Cyndi Lauper? Once again...not a fan, but I think what you hear is what you get with her. I saw her perform once at some kinda dinner party that I had press acess for. Basically the room was the size of a ballroom that people have weddings in, and she sounded as good there as she does on tape.


 
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Sam Gambino
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Dec 02, 2003
Posts: 2199
From: www.samgambino.com
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:33 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2004-10-25 15:17, TNTiki wrote:

Sam, why would Keith sing about a tonsillectomy and adenoidectomy?




Some say that he sounds like he just had a tonsillectomy when he sings...


 
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hanford_lemoore
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1874
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:42 pm   Permalink

Man it's so disheartening to hear that Ashlee is a lip syncer. She seems so real and in control on her TV show.

 
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MachTiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Posts: 1368
From: San Diego, CA
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:48 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2004-10-25 15:42, hanford_lemoore wrote:
Man it's so disheartening to hear that Ashlee is a lip syncer. She seems so real and in control on her TV show.



Look at it this way Hanford... We still have Jessica! I'm sure she's the real thing.


 
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Sam Gambino
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Joined: Dec 02, 2003
Posts: 2199
From: www.samgambino.com
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:54 pm   Permalink

For what it's worth, Hanford, we still have Keith too.




 
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hanford_lemoore
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1874
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2004-10-25 3:55 pm   Permalink

Keith who?


 
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MachTiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Posts: 1368
From: San Diego, CA
Posted: 2004-10-25 4:08 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2004-10-25 15:55, hanford_lemoore wrote:
Keith who?



Keith Simpson - The not-yet-famous lip-synching brother of Jessica & Ashlee.
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MachTiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Posts: 1368
From: San Diego, CA
Posted: 2004-10-25 5:39 pm   Permalink

You gotta love this quote from Lucky Magazine:

When asked what her take on lip-synching was, she had told the magazine, "I'm totally against it and offended by it. I'm going to let my real talent show, not just stand there and dance around. Personally, I'd never lip-synch. It's just not me."

Oops.


 
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