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Tiki Central Forums » » General Tiki » » Would you prefer Tiki as 'mainstream' or 'underground'?
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Would you prefer Tiki as 'mainstream' or 'underground'?
lucas vigor
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 12, 2004
Posts: 4089
From: SOCAL
Posted: 2012-05-27 09:58 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2012-05-25 23:36, JOHN-O wrote:
Quote:

On 2012-05-25 10:21, lucas vigor wrote:
"Hipsters" is exactly what modern tiki afficionados are.


Lucas, is that you finally coming out of the closet ?? !!

The term "hipster" has come to be like the term "Yuppie". At first it's kind of cool there's a specific label for the social demographic you might fall into but after a while it accumulates negative baggage. Then everyone talks about them but NO ONE will admit to being one.

Maybe "Tikiphile" will come to mean former "Punker" who is now a "Yuppie" but who really wants to be a "Hipster" (but who has grown too old to be labeled as such). And like these labels, if you're really defensive that's not you, THEN IT REALLY IS YOU.

Edit - And Lucas please don't read into that last paragraph as being directed toward you. It's more of a rhetorical question. Actually I think of you more as the grumpy old man at the dive bar but in your case 20 years ahead of the curve.


[ This Message was edited by: JOHN-O 2012-05-26 00:17 ]




I would say I personally fall in the "Yuppie" camp. But, I also don't get the whole "ironic hipster" thing...because for me, I like the original tiki scene much more then the current scene, cool as it may be. Given a choice, I would rather have lived during the original time period. The original tiki crowd were that era's equivelent of Yuppies. They liked a safe, sanitized version of the exotic culture...which was the original poly-pop...basically, several photos of crowds enjoying luaus in Sven's book is where I want to be. For me, Hawaiian music in a polynesian restaurant (with the floor show and fake cantonese cuisine) is what it is all about.
But, I can adapt to modern things. For example, PF Chang is to me the logical extension of the 1950's polynesian restaurant.


 
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AceExplorer
Grand Member (6 years)  

Joined: Apr 03, 2008
Posts: 2371
From: Deep in the Jacksonville Florida jungle.
Posted: 2012-05-27 10:50 am   Permalink


[/quote]
But, I can adapt to modern things. For example, PF Chang is to me the logical extension of the 1950's polynesian restaurant.
[/quote]

Lucas vigor: That's an interesting comment about PF Chang's. I had to think about it for a moment. True, Chang's is upscale, much like Don Beach and Vic Bergeron eventually became. But Chang's does lack some significant things like good cocktail mixology in their palate of offerings. So whether it's a logical extension of 50's Poly-pop would be good conversation over some Test Pilots or Zombies sometime. That definitely provokes some interesting thoughts...


 
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lucas vigor
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 12, 2004
Posts: 4089
From: SOCAL
Posted: 2012-05-27 11:40 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2012-05-27 10:50, AceExplorer wrote:



But, I can adapt to modern things. For example, PF Chang is to me the logical extension of the 1950's polynesian restaurant.
[/quote]

Lucas vigor: That's an interesting comment about PF Chang's. I had to think about it for a moment. True, Chang's is upscale, much like Don Beach and Vic Bergeron eventually became. But Chang's does lack some significant things like good cocktail mixology in their palate of offerings. So whether it's a logical extension of 50's Poly-pop would be good conversation over some Test Pilots or Zombies sometime. That definitely provokes some interesting thoughts...
[/quote]

I guess what I mean is, just like the total in-authenticity of yesterday's tiki restaurants (serving something that was in no way really chinese or even polynesian), PF Chang has got it nailed. Plus, the decor in those restaurants is really detailed. Check out the one at the anaheim garden walk mall (near disneyland) some time. The food is actually really good. True, they don't specialize in cocktails, though. But I am thinking that PF Changs is exactly like those types of places they had in the 50's, in spirit.

http://bunrab.com/dailyfeed/dailyfeed_images_nov-07/df07_11_24_insidepf.jpg

[ This Message was edited by: lucas vigor 2012-05-27 11:45 ]


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AceExplorer
Grand Member (6 years)  

Joined: Apr 03, 2008
Posts: 2371
From: Deep in the Jacksonville Florida jungle.
Posted: 2012-05-27 12:42 pm   Permalink

Lucas vigor: Got it, makes sense about PF Chang's, I agree! They do have good food, and I can't think of anyone who would decline an invitation to eat there.

You remind me of how nice it is to attend tiki events where good mixology is often present, and also the cameraderie of sharing quality drinks with others who actually can appreciate them. I really appreciate home tiki bars and those who are willing to share them.

Incidentally, we should have a name for tiki evangelism. Anyone? Bueller?


 
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King Bushwich the 33rd
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Jan 10, 2005
Posts: 1521
From: Ling Cod Beach, CA 90803
Posted: 2016-03-30 11:47 pm   Permalink

It's 10 years later (Ten Years After?) and the question remains.

How tiki is becoming cool again

So if the article says tiki is cool, does it mean that it's mainstream and, thus, uncool?

YouTube: Star Trek-Liars paradox



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tikiskip
Grand Member (8 years)  

Joined: Nov 26, 2005
Posts: 4809
Posted: 2016-03-31 07:28 am   Permalink

Could also be a case of a star burns brightest just before it goes out.

Lets hope not.
But then the new "tiki Bars" are mostly tiki lite or pretty tiki style.
Would rather go to an old bar / restaurant that is not tiki than these myself.
Note: I love B B Berry's bar, want to go, not his place I am talking about.


 
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EnchantedTikiGoth
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Posts: 288
From: Calgary, Canada
Posted: 2016-03-31 6:42 pm   Permalink

Well, I did just see some faux-Tiki stuff at Crate and Barrel the other day. The appetizer plates weren't too bad but we ended up getting the uninspiring mug because my wife liked the colour...

And Disney has opened up two Tiki bars now...

But I'm not fully convinced that Tiki has gone or is going mainstream. Certainly not like it did back in the Fifties and Sixties when it was on every other bowling alley and motel. Even the current surge in popularity seems more like a nostalgia kitsch thing rather than a real, vital, current part of mainstream Western culture. That's why Disney now has two Tiki bars and Crate and Barrel has one Tikish mug for the "oh my, isn't that just cute" crowd. For people who are legitimately into it, like I would assume we all are, then there will still be things that are interesting and well-made out there. That isn't going to go away, and that's the real fear that I think people might have... This idea that going mainstream means it will lose what you liked about it. I've never seen that happen with the half-dozen things I've been into that have gone through the same product life cycle.

But what do I know? I'm sitting here drinking a Pina Colada milkshake made with Mr. & Mrs. T syrup and "Original Bartender's Cocktail" banana pre-mix and Amarula, from a Crate and Barrel mug. I'm probably part of the problem.


[ This Message was edited by: EnchantedTikiGoth 2016-03-31 18:43 ]


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AdOrAdam
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Jun 16, 2013
Posts: 630
From: Wolverhampton, UK
Posted: 2016-04-03 1:46 pm   Permalink

This is an interesting post.

I don't mind if tiki was / is underground or mainstream.

When someone complains about traffic, I always think it's amusing because you are part of what makes up the traffic - if you weren't there... there would be less traffic.

Eg if you or I weren't here the number of tiki fans would decrease, multiplied many times making it less popular.

A few other posters hit on the idea of 'tiki' being cool by association (eg if Britney Spears was photographed with a mug & shirt). A decade on this 'cool by association' has happened but without a defining photo - tiki bars are a popular thing in the UK.

I think where your interests lie on 'the scale', what facet you enjoy.

To summarise what I enjoy about tiki it would be 'drinks & carvings', if someone else says 'shots & dancing in the tiki bar' then that's just something else.
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AkronTiki
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Jun 06, 2016
Posts: 18
From: Akron, OH
Posted: 2016-06-13 10:18 am   Permalink

It was interesting to read this thread all the way through. I can see the resurgence of Tiki back in the 90’s – but it seems I really saw the wave swell after Kirsten’s “Book of Tiki” was published back in ‘03. Not long after, I commonly saw Tiki-themed items almost everywhere, in mainstream retailers, discount stores and even the dollar stores. I bought some of that stuff for the mere fact that it was available--though I treasured the older, vintage stuff I later found in thrift stores a lot more. Even if I wanted to buy it, “retail Tiki” seems to be far less common now; maybe part of that comes from being here in the Midwest. If slightly less popular interest makes it easier to acquire better vintage items, that’s ok – but if it’s an inducement to make my own stuff—that’s fine too. And I will.

As a Baby-Boomer, there is a certain nostalgia associated with Tiki—one that I can associate with my father, a Marine who fought in the Pacific. There’s an aesthetic in vintage Tiki that I know he appreciated, and many of my generation probably have a vague affinity for it, too—even though most of them can’t consciously recall where it may come from: Maybe an old picture on a wall, their dad’s favorite Hawaiian shirt, a dusty lamp on a nightstand, or some old souvenirs on a basement shelf.

Friends my own age like Tiki Style because it’s comfortable, attractive and a kinda nostalgic. Younger people enjoy it because it seems exotic and a little strange. When we party at night around the pool, with the candles and Tiki torches lit, tasty drinks at the bar and a little Martin Denny emanating from the speakers hidden behind the hibiscus…it’s pure fantasy land. And that’s just the way we like it.


 
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ARTalaDANG
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Jun 14, 2016
Posts: 25
Posted: 2016-06-16 8:56 pm   Permalink

It's a double edged sword- if it's not pop enough, the diversity dwindles, icons are forced to either close or go 'applebees'. If it goes too pop, it gets bastardized and trivialized by those meddling kids.

The nice thing about Tiki culture is that there is a grumpy old drunk and an infiltrating hipster somewhere in us all. It's the Voodoo of pop culture, mixing just as many subcultures as there are ingredients in that tasty grayish brown drink in front of you.

So the question eats itself...


 
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bigbrotiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 11594
From: Tiki Island, above the Silverlake
Posted: 2016-06-16 10:24 pm   Permalink

For the rekkid, the Book of Tiki was first published in 2000. 2003 was the third printing. It did initiate the revival to go from Underground to Overground. But Tiki has steadfastly refused to become a "trend", even though some paper somewhere announced it as such every year after that.

While party store Tiki and Tiki Lite has come and gone and come again, "true" Tiki is a slow-growth industry, for it takes a long time to comprehend all the complex facets of the cult and recognize the Gesamtkunstwerk.

Thus, I see the old Sufi saying of "The Secret protects itself" as applicable: It is out there for everyone, but only the few who really delve into it and are struck with Tiki fever become initiates. Or "You can lead the horse to the Tiki bar, but it has to drink itself (from the wisdom of Tiki)"


 
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the_devils_tool
Grand Member (first year)  

Joined: Oct 20, 2015
Posts: 35
From: North Texas
Posted: 2016-06-17 05:39 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2016-06-16 22:24, bigbrotiki wrote:
Thus, I see the old Sufi saying of "The Secret protects itself" as applicable: It is out there for everyone, but only the few who really delve into it and are struck with Tiki fever become initiates. Or "You can lead the horse to the Tiki bar, but it has to drink itself (from the wisdom of Tiki)"



This is brilliant.
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AkronTiki
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Jun 06, 2016
Posts: 18
From: Akron, OH
Posted: 2016-06-17 08:34 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2016-06-16 22:24, bigbrotiki wrote:
For the rekkid, the Book of Tiki was first published in 2000. 2003 was the third printing.



Ah yes. I grow old and confused. I also blame the Amazon listing I referenced; though I probably actually did buy it in 2003, anyway. Always late to the party....


 
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komohana
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Nov 08, 2010
Posts: 503
From: Western Australia
Posted: 2016-06-17 5:37 pm   Permalink



Sagt es niemand, nur den Weisen,
Weil die Menge gleich verhöhnet...







 
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Club Nouméa
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 03, 2010
Posts: 454
From: Wanganui
Posted: 2016-06-20 9:14 pm   Permalink

An interesting thread. In terms of its relationship to the cultural mainstream, tiki culture (in its Californian incarnation) is similar to surf rock, or even punk rock in its Californian incarnation. There are periods when it has pushed its way above ground like an erupting volcano but it mainly seems to bubble away below the surface. Decades later though, it is still there, and it currently seems to be enjoying a comeback...

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The earliest known tiki mug: "Ruru and Weku", designed by Harry Hargreaves of Crown Lynn, New Zealand, 1949.

[ This Message was edited by: Club Nouméa 2016-06-20 21:18 ]


 
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