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Tiki Central Forums » » Bilge » » Legendary oldies radio station WCBS-FM, New York yanked for 'Jack'
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Legendary oldies radio station WCBS-FM, New York yanked for 'Jack'
donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2005-06-07 4:03 pm   Permalink

The whole backward logic of all of these broadcast conglomorates is that they don't give a rat's ass about listeners. They only care about what their advertisers think will be worth their money on a particular station, as they should. But if their radio station is nothing but a vehicle for advertising, maybe they should just play back-to-back commercials all hour and small blocks of music, it seems like they're close to doing that already.

I can't wait until the Infinitys & Clear Channels of the world find themselves in trouble once they have realized that they have chased their audiences away to satellite & non-commercial radio.

[ This Message was edited by: donhonyc on 2005-06-07 18:03 ]


 
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thejab
Grand Member (first year)  

Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 2986
From: Tradewinds Apartments, Alameda, CA
Posted: 2005-06-08 2:12 pm   Permalink

I just found out today that the oldies station 1510 AM here in the Bay Area was just bought by a California media conglomerate. This station has been on less than a year but it's the best oldies station I've heard in years. They only play 50s and 60s music, way more than the top 100 most played oldies format of most oldies stations, and I've heard some tunes I've never heard before.

Soon they are going to replace it with a station for aging hippies that plays the likes of Bonnie Raitt, Eric Clapton, etc.

OK, why can't these media corporations get it? They are leaving out a huge demographic! They readily cater to people over 50 (classic rock and top-100 oldies), and people under 30 (rap, hip hop, urban contemporary, "alternative rock"), but not us folks.

Here's the forgotten demographic:

Age: 30-50. We like a wide range of music: exotica, classic lounge, punk, soul, garage, rockabilly, etc. We know our music history, so we don't want to hear the same songs all the time. We have money. Some of us have kids and they get exposed to a wider range of music through us then the radio exposes them to. My friend Ed's kids are in their early teens and they love stuff like old Bowie, Iggy, and others that they never would hear on the radio.



 
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donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2005-06-08 3:21 pm   Permalink

I hear ya! I read something somebody said on another blog about how all of the pop music from the 50-70s (Beatles, Elvis, etc.) was going to go the way of Al Jolson and the like. I'm not so sure about that. Al Jolson was popular in the 20s (?) and was made for a different audience, Vaudeville to be exact. That stuff could definitely defined as 'Pop' but I don't think you could call it 'radio ready'. Here we are nearly 50 years after Elvis surfaced, and over 40 years since The Beatles appeared and there doesn't seem to be an end in sight for either, and maybe there never will be. I know alot of kids who like the Beatles. That stuff, as is alot of stuff from the 60s has no generational discrmination. Where do you think alot of these indie bands get there inspiration for songwriting?? The Beatles!!!! How many times do we hear, "so-and-so band or so-and-so artist has (almost) broken the pop chart record of the Beatles". They were talking about it last month when 50 Cent had a ton of hits in the top ten. The point is is that it probably won't happen the same way again, but the industry and the press always use The Beatles as the yardstick.

Meanwhile I have been listening to a great internet radio station called 3WK Classic Underground Radio. Great, great stuff. If you like Humble Pie, Stooges, MC5, Blue Cheer,Ten Years After, Grand Funk Railroad, etc. check it out
http://www.3wk.com/. It's like what FM radio sounded like when it first blew up in the mid/late 60s. Great underground rock with some bands I've never even heard of. You can get it on iTunes as well. Put it on with the Vizualizer on your iBook and trip out!!!!!!

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Cool Manchu
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Joined: Aug 03, 2003
Posts: 561
From: San Jose, CA
Posted: 2005-06-10 11:23 am   Permalink

Quote:
It was also home to many legendary New York DJs like 'Cousin Brucie' Morrow, Don K. Reed, and Bill Brown.



When signing into Siruis this morning to listen at work I saw this...Thought you might like to know...

One of NYC’s most legendary—and beloved—radio personalities is coming to SIRIUS.

Bruce Morrow, aka “Cousin Brucie,” will debut on SIRIUS during the July 4th weekend with a special broadcast from the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum in Cleveland.

The Brooklyn-born Morrow has been a NYC radio institution for more than 40 years, and has remained one of its most popular personalities. He’s spun the hits on NYC radio stations WINS, WABC-AM and, until June 3, WCBS-FM. Morrow has been inducted into the National Association of Broadcasters’ Radio Hall of Fame, the Broadcasting & Cable Hall of Fame, the Radio Hall of Fame (Chicago) and was honored for his on-air work by the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum.

“This is one of the most exciting events of my career,” said Morrow. “I feel like I’m riding a rocket ship—or should I say ‘satellite’? I now have the opportunity with SIRIUS to reach the national audience I’ve always wanted to communicate with. Here comes the music!”

Following the July 4th event at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, Morrow will host three regularly scheduled programs each week and numerous daily features from SIRIUS’ NYC national broadcast studios.


 
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TikiGardener
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Joined: Mar 24, 2002
Posts: 1362
From: 1st website dedicated to Tiki Gardens
Posted: 2005-06-10 11:28 am   Permalink

Sirius, please hire me.

 
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tikibars
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Joined: Apr 11, 2002
Posts: 2024
From: Aku Hall, Chicago
Posted: 2005-06-10 12:27 pm   Permalink

Oldies 104.3 here in Chicago went Jack this month too. Grrr....

 
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donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2005-06-10 1:01 pm   Permalink

Cool Manchu-

Thanks for the update. I heard about this yesterday via the NYRMB (New York Radio Message Board). It's a blog that is used heavily by industry people and some radio fans as well. It's been up since 1997 and this whole CBS-FM debacle has given the board the most hits (over 100,000 in a week) that it's ever had! They had to make a special auxilary blog just for the CBS issue. If your interested you can check it out at

http://musicradio.computer.net/anotherboard/wwwboard/

Chicago! We feel your pain and we're aware of the rug being pulled from beneath you as well. There has been talk of this on the NYRMB as you will see if you check it out.

As far as this Sirius Satellite Radio issue is concerned I can see myself becoming a subscriber in the near future. I'm not thrilled by the initial $250-300 investment. That's a little steep for frickin radio, but I am a radio fan, and I would like to hear Cousin Brucie and some of the other programing they have, so I guess I'll have to splurge. At this point, terrestrial radio is all but dead. Right now I am listening to the Classic Rock station here in New York Q-104.3. I was never a huge fan of this station. The jocks kinda suck, alot of them sound like Coors Light swilling frat guys. I've seen pictures of some of them and one still has a mullet!! Um excuse me...you're playing music that originated in the counter-culture of yore. Remember? Back when the word 'cool' actually had some meaning. Why Q-104.3 wants jocks that sound like they just got off the golf course is beyond me. With the exception of Scott Muni, who died this past year, I really didn't listen to them THAT much. Case in point: they just played Aerosmith 'Dream On' for the ka-billionth time!!!! AAAARRGGGGGHHHH!! Hello!!! There is 35 years of 'Classic Rock' out there! Open up the playlists!!! Play a different song....Play a different Aerosmith song! 'Toys In the Attic'!! That's a great song!! NEVER hear it on the radio. They'd rather play 'Dude Looks Like A Lady' OR 'Dream On'....again!!
I know it's a lost cause, but I'll say it anyway.....Bring back WCBS-FM! I listen to my 'Classic Rock' (I hate that term) on my own.

If I can site some lyrics by Queen here:

All we hear is radio ga ga
Radio goo goo
Radio ga ga
All we hear is radio ga ga
Radio blah blah
Radio what's new ?
Radio, someone still loves you


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Cool Manchu
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Joined: Aug 03, 2003
Posts: 561
From: San Jose, CA
Posted: 2005-06-10 3:11 pm   Permalink

Aloha DonHoNYC,

Well if you are considering buying a satellite radio, let me give you my candid opinion:

1. You will need to buy a radio as you noted. But I hear you can pick one up for around 50 bucks (including the 50 dollar mail-in rebate)

2. It costs around 9 to 11 dollars a month (Sirius is 11, XM is 9) I chose Sirius because XM is Clear Channel. You can buy a lifetime subscription for around 500 bucks from Sirius, I don't know if XM offers this.

3. I bought a package deal from Costco, it included the in car kit and a boom box. However, if I knew that the boom box wouldn't work in my house, I would have never bought the whole package and stuck with the car kit.

4. The car kit has an FM transponder, but I found that I constantly had to change the stations because of interference from local stations. I ended up buying one of the cassette adapter kits and it took care of the problem, but it was $23 more of an investment.

5. You can listen to Sirius through your computer. It's not the greatest quaility, but 'taint bad neither.

6. I always have something to listen to. I love the selections. Sirius has tons of rock stations and 80s stations. I wish that they had a better selection of lounge music.

7. They have Mojo Nixon, Joan Jett and many others as DJs. I really dig Mojo's show.

8. Since the FCC doesn't have the ability to regulate satellite radio, you can hear the full length versions of songs unedited. They don't play commericials on most of the music stations. Also, a couple of weeks ago, they played the entire side one of Rush's 2112. When do you hear that on the radio? And while I hear Dude Looks like a Lady much too frequently, they do play many other songs you don't hear often on regular radio. Sticking with Aerosmith, I have heard Uncle Salty, Mama Kin, Toys in the Attic, Adam's Apple, Kings and Queens and so on....so they do have diversity. However, they seem to have a rotation that they stick with for a week or two before they change it, so you will hear Golden Earring - Radar Love almost every day if you are in the car, or Hocus Pocus by Focus....

9. The satellite drops out momentarily if you are driving in the city due to tall buildings and it also drops out if you are driving through heavily wooded areas (this pisses me off).

10. If I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't buy the boombox, but I definately would still buy the satellite radio.



[ This Message was edited by: Cool Manchu on 2005-06-10 15:14 ]


 
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donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2005-06-10 9:47 pm   Permalink

Cool Manchu-

Thanks for the info dude. Yeah I think I'm gonna get serious about Sirius (bwahaha). I don't own a car (city dweller) so I don't have to worry about that. I would hook the satellite receiver up to one of my home stereos. What I'm wondering is, I have a medium size Westinghouse transistor radio, like a 'take it to the beach radio'. Do these satellite receivers have the capability of swaping units (sounds obscene) like if I wanted to hook the Sat receiver up to my stereo could I take and stick it on my transistor radio to-go if I wanted?

Whatever the case, your info was real helpful. So you're telling me I can get one of these Sat. receivers retail and I don't have to order it through Sirius? I was under the impression that I had to get the thing directly from them. I'll do some further invetigatin' when I'm ready for the plunge. But I can tell you this, I will definitely be doing it. Sounds very cool. Big fan of Joan Jett, I'm sure her show is pretty cool. If anybody from the 80s still has rock n roll credibility it's defnitely her. Always dug her music and respected what she did.

Mojo Nixon!! Holy shite! Haven't heard from him in eons. Does he ever play "Stuffin' Martha's Muffin" on his show? That song is HIGH-larious!!

Cheers mate!


 
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TikiGardener
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Joined: Mar 24, 2002
Posts: 1362
From: 1st website dedicated to Tiki Gardens
Posted: 2005-06-10 10:06 pm   Permalink

Hey Don, Next time I'm in NYC, I'm setting aside an evening so yous and me can drink our collective sorrows away. And bitch to high heaven, and give the one fingered salute to anyone who disagrees with us. I'll bring the Bill Hicks cd's, and Action Time and Vision on continous loop. You bring whatever the hell you want.

Is it a date?


 
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donhonyc
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Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Posts: 1173
From: The Quiet EAST Village
Posted: 2005-06-10 11:35 pm   Permalink

Don't forget to bring some George Carlin too. What's 'Action Time and Vision'?

 
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Cool Manchu
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Joined: Aug 03, 2003
Posts: 561
From: San Jose, CA
Posted: 2005-06-11 07:54 am   Permalink

Hello DonHoNYC,

With the FM Transponder, you can do all the swappin' you want, as long as the radio picks up FM stations and you have a place to plug in the satellite receiver. Even the boom box doesn't take batteries, so I am assuming it soaks up a lot of juice...

Just make sure that you can put the antenna outside of the house somehow with a direct line to the sky. Unless they make something that I am not aware of for in house use (which is quite possible, because I am not an expert on the hardware).

There are a ton of companies that make units for both Sirius and XM, so you do not have to buy one directly from them.

Lastly, the only Mojo Nixon song I have heard him play was Elvis is Everywhere. And I have to agree, Michael J. Fox has no Elvis in him.





[ This Message was edited by: Cool Manchu on 2005-06-11 07:56 ]


 
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ikitnrev
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Joined: Jul 27, 2002
Posts: 1313
From: D.C. / Virginia
Posted: 2005-06-11 10:50 am   Permalink

I listen to XM satellite radio, and it is very tough to go back and listen to a regular radio broadcast in somebody else's car, especially with all the constant advertising. I think I'm sold on Satellite radio for life.

XM recently had a week where their 1960's channel played, in chronological order, their entire 60's set list - that is over 2700 songs, with no song repeated (and no commercials), over a one week period. That was pretty cool, to see how the musical styles slowly changed over that decade.

I am unfamiliar with the programming of Sirius radio - my impression is that there are probably more similarities than differences between the two providers. XM and Sirius are working to develop a receiver that would be capable of receiving both services, but there is so much musical and programming variety contained with one service, that subscribing to both would be overkill.

Many people will likely choose their service based on the car they bought (XM has an exclusive deal with General Motors, Sirius with Ford) or the store where they bought the service (Sirius has a deal with Radio Shack) Others will choose their satellite provider based on unique programming (XM has every major league baseball game, Sirius has the NFL, and soon Howard Stern, etc, etc.) XM appears to be in a more stable financial position and has many more subscribers, but it is still an industry that is still generally in its infancy.

Most users will spend 90% of their time listening to 5 or 10 of their favorite stations, and mostly ignore what is happening on the other channels. I myself like to rotate, one by one, through all the different channels, and discover new artists and songs. Just like regular radio programming, Sirius and XM both have the right to alter programming and add or eliminate program channels whenever they wish, which means you will still have to get used to your favorite obscure station suddenly not being there one day.

I will correct a few statements that foolmanchu made

- XM now costs $13/month. They offer discounted plans if you purchase anywhere from 1 year to 5 years of programming.

- XM and Sirius are both regulated by the FCC, but most of this attention is involved with the licensing of the satellites and allotment of the frequency channels, and the use of ground transmitters that repeat the signal in the crowded urban corridors. The FCC could also in the future insist that public service channels be allocated. But foolmanchu is correct that generally, the FCC keeps its hands off in areas of programming - but I wouldn't expect any 'Let's Overthrow the Government' channels anytime soon.

- As for home reception, not only do you need direct access to the open sky for your antenna, that access has to be oriented to the south, which is the direction that the satellites are positioned. I can place my antenna in my south facing window and receive great reception, but it is very difficult if I place the antenna in a north facing window. This direct line-of-sight is the reason why you can lose transmission while in heavily wooded areas, or while standing under a bridge, or driving along the side of a steep hill or mountain.

It is hard, for a music lover, to describe the thrill of satellite radio. With regular radio, there might be two cool channels that you flipped between. With satellite radio, there are dozens of good channels, and the challenge is that you can only listen to one of those stations at a time.

Vern


 
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stuff-o-rama
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Joined: Nov 20, 2003
Posts: 751
From: Central Coast of California
Posted: 2005-06-22 1:14 pm   Permalink

Did anyone catch Jonesy's Jukebox yesterday? He had Paul Anka on the show. True to Jonesy's form they played a couple of songs impromptu. It was cool and crazy at the same time. He sang "Put Your Head On My Shoulder" "Wonderwall" and "Smells Like Teen Spirit" Seriously, Anka has a new rock ablum of rock covers he's promoting. He was trying so hard to be cool, Steve Jones was so excited to have him there he kept asking him about the rat pack, Tom Jones and such. One of the best shows I've heard in a long time. The said in Entertainment Weekly that Jonesy's Jukebox may go syndicated and there's talk of him putting his show on satellte radio too. I hope he stays in LA though...

 
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freddiefreelance
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Joined: Feb 15, 2003
Posts: 2993
From: San Diego, Ca.
Posted: 2005-10-07 08:45 am   Permalink

Little Steven Van Zant vs. "The Fucking Pussies":

Quote:

Little Steven's keynote address at the Radio and Records 2005 Convention.



Date: Thursday, July 23, 2005
Place: Renaissance Hotel, Cleveland, Ohio
Audience: 250 Program Directors

Fred Jacobs introduces a four-minute video bio. At its conclusion, the Dovells' You Can't Sit Down explodes from the speakers as five Go-Go girls come out of the wings surrounding Fred, much to his discomfort. Little Steven enters to thunderous applause. He cuts off the music with a wave of his hand, leans into the microphone and says "Ladies and Gentlemen, Fred Jacobs."

The music returns as the girls exit. A stunned audience applauds wildly as Fred, very uncharacteristically, dances off with them.

Little Steven: Well that was worth the price of admission alone. (more applause and laughter... Steven paces with the hand held mic for a minute, and then. . . )

"I Love Radio! (applause once again erupts) And I feel nothing but love in this room because as I look around, I see only two kinds of people. Our beloved affiliates . . . and future affiliates. (laughter) So no matter what happens in this next half hour, remember what I just said. It's just family talking. And without any further disclaimers let me ask the only important question that is on my mind, and I'm sure you've been thinking about it also, especially lately.

(pause)

When Did The Fucking Pussies Take Over?

(applause and laughter)

When? Don't you look forward to the day when your grandson is on your knee and he looks up and says, "Grampa weren't you in radio once?"

"Yes, Grandson," you'll reply.

"Could I ask you something," he'll say.

"Of course, my love, anything," you'll say.

"Grampa where were you When The Fucking Pussies Took Over?" (more laughter)

Where were we? What happened? Things are out of line and we're not leaving here today until we straighten it out.

(applause and laughter)

Now I was going to wait for this but we might as well get right to it since it is all everybody's talking about. I have come to praise JACK not to bury him. (laughter - uncertain applause) The guys at Infinity are friends of ours, as is everybody else, we got nothing but friends you all know that. And I've gotta say I'm proud of these guys for having the balls to shake things up. Things needed shaking up. And history will remember them in a very positive way when looking back at this world changing moment. Having
said that . . .

Replacing 33 year old New York oldies institution CBS-FM with JACK is like replacing the Statue of Liberty with a blow-up doll.

(eruptions of laughter and applause)

But again, change is good. And necessary. With a little bit of luck JACK will last 10 or 12 months because it is obvious people want something different, they are hungry for something, anything. So it could be 6 months before anybody actually listens to JACK. Once they do it is doomed for 3 obvious reasons. At the moment it is replacing oldies formats but it is not an oldies format in the true sense of the word. It's mostly 80's, some 70's, some 90's. Now it must be said that the oldies format is vulnerable because over the last 5-10 years it has, in a word, sucked. It has sucked for a very simple reason, somebody had the brilliant idea to eliminate the 50's and replace it with the 70's. This was done by somebody uniquely stupid and deaf and ignorant and a bad businessman on top of it all. So naturally, everybody copied it and the 50's disappeared virtually overnight.

Now let's digress and examine this oldies thing for a minute. Assuming you accept the fact that those overseeing the oldies format these last 5 years - 10 years - are, in fact, stupid, deaf, ignorant, and bad businessmen, let's deal with it. As far as stupid, deaf, and ignorant, when it comes to decades that matter, that matter historically, in terms of influence, importance, and never-to-be-heard-again-quality - that is the 50's and 60's. Everything we do, everything we are comes from those two decades.

You're gonna throw one away? You're gonna replace Elvis, Little Richard, Gene Vincent, Eddie Cochran, Johnny Burnette, Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Buddy Holly, Lloyd Price, and Fats Domino with, all due respect, Donna Summer and the Bee Gees? You're gonna replace primal, vital, timeless, forever cool rock and roll pioneers with disco? Disco?

You wanna know what disco is good for? Disco is for when you're drunk at a wedding with your old lady and you want to act like an idiot and be John Travolta for an hour or two. That's where it belongs. Not on radio.

And to the issue of oldies being bad business - all you hear - I'm assuming from sales people - is we must lower our demo's. The oldies demographic are getting too old - that's the rationale for replacing the 50's with the 70's.

Now if all there was to sell in the world were Fruit Loops, Play Stations, and sneakers - they might have a point. But I got a little secret to share. You know that age group - 35 to 65 - that nobody in sales seems to care about?

That's Where All The Fucking Money Is!

(laughter, applause)

I mean ALL the fucking money.

35 to 65.

Memo to sales team - Sell Them Something!

And, by the way, if you want younger people listening, you can get that done. And I mean kids, if you want them.

Who is cooler? Early Elvis or Elton John?

What appeals more to kids, Gene Vincent's black leather attitude, Eddie Cochran's teenage frustration, Little Richard's cry of liberation, and Dion's total Soprano's coolness - or the Eagles?

You want wild? Put together the Sex Pistols, Audioslave, and the Wu-Tang Clan - they aren't as wild as Jerry Lee Lewis in his prime.

But you have to explain that. Show it, illustrate, educate, sell it.

Alright - digression over - so JACK isn't oldies so it must be some kind of classic rock/pop hybrid. But JACK doesn't address the two biggest problems of classic rock. 15 years ago I said we're chasing all the personality out of rock radio and into talk and sports. And the ratings went with it.

We need more personality, not less, and JACK has none. No DJ's means no personal relationship with the audience. Eventual apathy is inevitable.

The other big issue classic rock must consider is it must start playing new music again.

I've suggested it to my own affiliates and I'll keep saying it every change I get. We've got a big problem.

Look around. Pearl Jam does some business. Dave Matthews - if he's rock at all - does well. Maybe Oasis breaks this year in the U.S. Maybe Coldplay - if they're considered rock.

But in a real sense, the last big band through the door was U2. That's 25 years ago."


_________________
Rev. Dr. Frederick J. Freelance, Ph.D., Th.D., D.F.S


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