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Tiki Central Forums » » Beyond Tiki » » Harry Potter and the HBP - includes SPOILERS!!!
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Harry Potter and the HBP - includes SPOILERS!!!
PapeToaTane
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Joined: Mar 19, 2005
Posts: 518
From: Hyderabad, India
Posted: 2005-08-02 6:32 pm   Permalink

If you don't want to read things about the new book that might spoil it for you - CLICK OUT NOW!!!

Tikibelle suggested this. I'm up for it if you are.

I read it once (devoured it, is more like it!) - and just finished listening to the Jim Dale (American) version of the Book on Tape.

I thought it was great!!!! The formula was a little different, true - but it had me from the first chapter!!

Snape's role in helping Draco Malfoy finish the "job" surprised me. I truly thought Dumbledore was right about him being on the side of the Order all this time. I figured there was some loophole to the unbreakable oath. I did not see the fact of him being the HBP coming, either - although, some of the kids at my church did. They're better seers than me!

I don't think we've seen the last of Harry at Hogwarts. He'll come back. He'll need guidance. And because Dumbledore's painting is now hanging in McGonagall's office (from the last chapter), and that tells me we've not seen the last of Dumbledore, either.

I'm pretty sure Sirius will remain dead - but - Tonk's patronus is a dog now (or, so we think) - perhaps he's not all-the-way gone.

Should be a great finale!!!


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Riptide
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Joined: Jan 12, 2005
Posts: 379
From: Garden Grove, CA
Posted: 2005-08-02 7:46 pm   Permalink

Well, call me crazy, but...

I don't think that Dumbledore is really dead & I think that Snape will turn out to be still a member of "The Order of the Phoenix". I think this was all planned by The Order (and Dumbledore) so Snape will be able to get in very close to Voldemort. He also had to "protect" Draco, which is why even though the other Death Eaters said that Draco had to kill Dumbledore, it was Snape that barged in and cast the spell. I think this is what he and Dumbledore had planned.

We shall see if I am right in a couple of years, then I will show off with this post. (Or I'll hide it and never mention any of this craziness if I am totally wrong.)


 
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docwoods
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Joined: Feb 29, 2004
Posts: 599
From: outside the windy city
Posted: 2005-08-03 05:24 am   Permalink

Riptide,I'm with you!Throughout all the books,Dumbledore kept saying he trusted Snape completely.He's no idiot,and Snape would really have to make it look good as far as Voldemort goes.Just curious-has anyone ever wondered what Dumbledore's patronus is?Remember,before he became Headmaster,he was the Transfigurations teacher.

 
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Tikibelle
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Joined: Sep 28, 2002
Posts: 58
From: Carson, CA
Posted: 2005-08-04 6:36 pm   Permalink

Yippie, Yippie, Yippie!!!! a spoiler thread!!! I can at last vent and chat about the book!!!

 
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Tikibelle
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Joined: Sep 28, 2002
Posts: 58
From: Carson, CA
Posted: 2005-08-04 6:57 pm   Permalink

So, I am curious if we will even see a book 7, but PapeToaTane is pry right Harry still needs guidance. I can’t believe that she killed off Dumbledore, but I do believe that Dumbledore (as well as Sirius) will remain dead. Although, I think that PapeToaTane is right “because Dumbledore's painting is now hanging in McGonagall's office… (which) tells me we've not seen the last of Dumbledore.” The painting is what confirmed Dumbledore’s death for me. I did think that Sirius was not really dead until J.K.R. had the guts to kill off Dumbledore.

I disagree about Tonks’ patronus, I think we were supposed to think it was a dog until the end when we understood that it was actually a wolf (Lupin.)

I didn’t think that the unbreakable oath was going to have a loophole. I thought that it was proof that Snape was a good guy. You know, protect the kids. I don’t think it’s a scheme. Why would Dumbledore have arranged his own death? (God, I sobbed.)


docwoods, Didn’t Dumbledore's patronus show up in an earlier book? Wasn’t it a phoenix? I could be wrong, but it does make sense. Or were you referring to his animalgius (sp?) like Pro. McGonagall’s cat?

As for Snape being the half-blooded Prince, I felt like I should have known, but I thought it was Voldemort. Was anyone else with me on that one?

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[ This Message was edited by: Tikibelle 2005-08-04 19:00 ]


 
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PapeToaTane
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Joined: Mar 19, 2005
Posts: 518
From: Hyderabad, India
Posted: 2005-08-04 7:09 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2005-08-04 18:57, Tikibelle wrote:

I disagree about Tonks’ patronus, I think we were supposed to think it was a dog until the end when we understood that it was actually a wolf (Lupin.)



You are right....I re-listened to the last tape - I had missed that!! It's a wolf! My bad!!
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Tiki-Kate
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Joined: Sep 21, 2003
Posts: 1700
From: Yucaipa, CA
Posted: 2005-08-04 7:18 pm   Permalink

R.A.B.

Regulus Black, right?


 
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docwoods
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Joined: Feb 29, 2004
Posts: 599
From: outside the windy city
Posted: 2005-08-05 05:34 am   Permalink

Tikibelle-I can't remember if Dumbledore's patronus appeared in an earlier book,but I don't know if we've ever been told what his Animagus is.Anyone think that one's patronus and animagus are the same?TikiKate-I thought the same thing about R.A.B.,but then again Susan Bones' mother's name was Amelia Bones.Makes one wonder...

 
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Tikibelle
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Joined: Sep 28, 2002
Posts: 58
From: Carson, CA
Posted: 2005-08-05 10:07 am   Permalink

Well, here’s another bone to chew on…
Did Dumbledore have to die so that Harry would be able to stand on his own at the end? To be the true hero. And on further thought maybe Sirius really isn’t dead, but just trapped in some kind of limbo. Maybe Harry will find a way to bring him back. This may be wishful thinking on my part.

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Tikibelle
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Joined: Sep 28, 2002
Posts: 58
From: Carson, CA
Posted: 2005-08-05 12:01 pm   Permalink

Who is R.A.B. ?
The following note is encased in the fake Horcrux (the locket). Harry reads it on the night of Dumbledore's death:

“To the Dark Lord
I now I will be dead long before you read this but I want you to know that it was I who discovered your secret. I have stolen the real Horcrux and intend to destroy it as soon as I can.
I face death in the hope that when you meet your match you will be mortal once more.
R.A.B.”


R.A.B. could be Sirius's brother, Regulus Black. The author addresses Voldemort as "the Dark Lord," Regulus fled from the Death Eaters and was killed several days later, giving him enough time to find one Horcrux (if he knew where to look).

Here is the most convincing bit of evidence I have seen for R.A.B. to be Regulus Black...

“There was a musical box that emitted a faintly sinister, tinkling tune when wound, and they all found themselves becoming curiously weak and sleepy, until Ginny had the sense to slam the lid shut; a heavy locket that none of them could open; a number of ancient seals; and, in a dusty box, an Order of Merlin, First Class, that had been awarded to Sirius's grandfather for 'services to the Ministry'.”
- Chapter Six ("The Noble and Most Ancient House of Black") of Order of the Phoenix

Someone suggested it is someone from Susan Bones's family. Voldemort killed the Mme/ Bones himself, and she put up a good fight. A family of very powerful witches and wizards that did indeed seek to destroy Voldemort through and through. Amelia Bones? She is mentioned as one of those 'gruesome murders' in chapter 1, which notes that she died in a room 'locked from the inside'; Dumbledore says she is a 'gifted witch' so, perhaps she died destroying the locket?

The A could stand for and i.e. Rudolfus and Bellatrix (the lestranges) although the letter does say I and not We. Just a thought, or rather a long shot, Robert(a) A. Botts -- aka Bertie Botts.

Well that’s all for now.


 
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PapeToaTane
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Joined: Mar 19, 2005
Posts: 518
From: Hyderabad, India
Posted: 2005-08-05 12:48 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2005-08-05 10:07, Tikibelle wrote:
Well, here’s another bone to chew on…
Did Dumbledore have to die so that Harry would be able to stand on his own at the end? To be the true hero.





Yeah, I think so. This was foreshadowed a bit when you juxtapose the two comments made before and after Harry and Dumbledore went into the cave after the horcrux. Before Harry left Ron and Hermione at Hogwarts (when he gave them the felix potion), they said to Harry "... be safe." He said he would..."I'll be with Dumbledore!" When Albus was weak from the potion, Harry helped him out of the cave and he said to Harry that he wasn't worried... "I'm with YOU!"
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john
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Joined: May 05, 2005
Posts: 345
From: Chandler, Arizona
Posted: 2005-08-05 1:06 pm   Permalink



check out this shirt


 
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tikiwinebear
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Joined: Sep 30, 2004
Posts: 582
From: Santa Rosa, CA (Sonoma - wine country)
Posted: 2005-08-09 09:57 am   Permalink

My hunches are the same as posed by Riptide.

I also believe the locket has much more importance than just holding the hidden note. Could Dumbledore have (I forget the exact terms) used the locket as a Horcrux for himself, as the Voldemort had done in multiple objects? Rowling makes a big to do near the end about Harry clutching the locket and keeping it safe, as if he is keeping Dumbledore safe for the final battle.

Though I have always suspected foul play by Snapes, if Dumbledore trusted him, I believe Snape had a roll in Dumbledore's death, but will also assist in his resurrection in the future. Thoughout all the books, Snape helped make Harry stronger and better suited for his final battle with Voldemort. I believe Snape is still part of the Order.

I was a bit unhappy about Rowling not creating new and magical scenes and characters, as she had done in the previous books. But, this book was never boring or slow, and always held my interest. I guess after 5 years at Hogworts, situations have to settle down! It was a nice touch to see her bring back some of the characters from the past... especially for Dumbledore's funeral.
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PapeToaTane
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 19, 2005
Posts: 518
From: Hyderabad, India
Posted: 2005-08-09 2:42 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2005-08-09 09:57, tikiwinebear wrote:

I also believe the locket has much more importance than just holding the hidden note. Could Dumbledore have (I forget the exact terms) used the locket as a Horcrux for himself, as the Voldemort had done in multiple objects?




No. At least I don't think so. In order to make a horcrux, one needs to "split one's soul", no? - and - according to what we've read, and the instructions given to Voldemort on how to make a horcrux, one needs to have committed a murder in order to do it. I can't recall that Dumbledore ever murdered anyone.


 
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Benehune
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Joined: Mar 22, 2005
Posts: 248
Posted: 2005-08-09 7:57 pm   Permalink

I think a lot of clues are in book one. Reread it and you will find that tidbits from that book have played vital roles throughout the series. You will also find Snape announcing that he can put a "stopper in death." Maybe that was the liquid that Dumbledore drank?

 
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