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Tiki Central Forums Collecting Tiki Where are all the RED Tiki Mugs??
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Where are all the RED Tiki Mugs??
stuckieshaft
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 24, 2002
Posts: 177
Posted: 2003-05-03 2:13 pm   Permalink

First off, the reason you dont see many red glazes are not only becuase they may be unsafe. Red glazes are notoriously hard to fire, just look at the example of the red saint thomas mug.

Secondly, All glazes are going to be unsafe before being fired. During the fireing process most of the bad "unsafe" components are burnt out.
And yes you could put the leaded glaze on the outside of the mug and a food safe glaze on the inside.

Also, this all only applies to low fire glazes. High fire is totally safe.

Anyways if you have doubts I would advise you to call a glaze manufacturer, like laguna clay or duncan.

-stuckie


 
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Tiki Diablo
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Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: 1907
From: socal
Posted: 2003-05-04 11:52 pm   Permalink

I likes red. Coming out with one soon.

 
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Tiki_Bong
Deleted

Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 0
Posted: 2003-05-05 09:46 am   Permalink

I have one older mug that's red. It's from 'The Mandarin' and looks kinda like an Ali'i mug.

I like red also. All the way from dark red to Jane Fonda red...
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Exoticat
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 08, 2003
Posts: 481
From: Hutikihi Island ~ near Seattle
Posted: 2003-05-06 03:46 am   Permalink

<<She looked at me funny and said "Are you sure you want it that dark in your room?" I said "I want it to look like a cheesy whore house" She said OOOOO. K. and started mixing. >>

ha ha ha Laney

That reminds me of the time that I was buying BRIGHT yellow paint at the Home Depot and was asked what I was using it for. I said, "I'm creating a Laugh In wall for an event ," and I got one of those blank stares.

If you ever paint your bedroom red, you'll have to photograph it for us. My niece and her husband just bought a victorian house and are going to do a Moulin Rouge bedroom... I can't wait to see how that turns out!


 
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Saint-Thomas
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Sep 26, 2002
Posts: 39
From: Knoxhell
Posted: 2003-05-07 08:08 am   Permalink

That's strange, it looks very pink in this context, but it was more of a crimson color in my photo editor....

Here's the deal on red. The colors red, orange, and yellow all depend on compounds which are normally very toxic and/or unstable. Things like Cadmium, Chromium, Uranium, Cupric Oxide (copper)just to name a few. However, that doesn't mean that your browns and greens are safe. Here's a MSDS quote for Manganese which is frequently used for rich, chocolaty browns:
"....adversely affect central nervous system with symptoms including languor,..., weakness, emotional disturbances,...,and paralysis."
It sounds pretty bad, right? But in a glaze, it should be safe. Why? Because glazes are made of glass. Proffessionals spend huge amounts of time testing, formulating, and testing again their glazes to assure that they are fully melted and as resistent to leaching as possible. However, Not all you buy follows the same self-imposed guidelines that some of us potters follow.
Try this experiment: Go buy a cheap green or blue plate at you local thrift store or Wal-Mart. Place a slice of lemon on it over night and see if the color changes. That color change is copper or cobalt coming out of the glaze and going into your body.

I'll get to the point about reds... at earthenware temperatures reds are no big deal. However, these same formulae don't work at a temperature where the clay will vitrify (ie. become waterproof.) A ceramist's options become more limited at this stage and generally more expensive. I personally know of a few ways to get a safe deep red, but can't afford it, so I have been satisfied for the time being with crimsons and pinks.

On a similar note, anything metallic looking is definitely NOT safe!!! There is way too much metal in that glaze and you will end up drinking it. The only exception is Gold which is likely real gold (Au) but you are still drinking it!!

Sorry for the long post. Anyone who wants to know more can email me. I love this stuff!
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Cultjam
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Joined: Apr 21, 2002
Posts: 367
From: Phoenix, Arizona
Posted: 2003-05-07 11:33 am   Permalink

Saint-Thomas,

Please no apologies, that's great info. If you have anything to add, post it.



 
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KokomoTikiBar&Grill
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Joined: May 20, 2002
Posts: 429
From: KOKOMO, MISSISSIPPI
Posted: 2003-05-07 1:25 pm   Permalink

THe Red Tiki mugs I used to make were totally food safe. Duncan makes a red glaze called Red Ripe Tomato that is safe. Hard as hell to get a good coverage unless you apply three coats. I think there were some pictures somewhere on here where I put up some red ones. Oh well.

 
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Saint-Thomas
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Sep 26, 2002
Posts: 39
From: Knoxhell
Posted: 2003-05-07 1:27 pm   Permalink

One more thing:
I didn't want to scare everyone into not using ceramics anymore! The truth is, nearly all ceramic materials are bad for you, (clay itself causes cancer!!) but only in certain forms. Even if you are leaching some cobalt out into your coffee, tea or whatever, it is a very miniscule amount. You are exposed to far worse by drinking your municipal water, breathing air, and driving your car.
Responsible ceramists try to reduce the exposure of certain chemicals not only because it is the right thing to do, but it shows poor craftsmanship when your glaze starts fading away after it has been through the dishwasher 10 times.
Red glaze isn't that much worse for you than blue, its just a difficult color to get on utility ware. If one had a fuel burning kiln, one could basically "cook" the Oxygen out of Cupric Oxide which would, more or less, change it from green to red.



 
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Saint-Thomas
Tiki Centralite

Joined: Sep 26, 2002
Posts: 39
From: Knoxhell
Posted: 2003-05-07 1:43 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2003-05-07 13:25, KokomoTikiBar&Grill wrote:
THe Red Tiki mugs I used to make were totally food safe. Duncan makes a red glaze called Red Ripe Tomato that is safe. Hard as hell to get a good coverage unless you apply three coats.



Ah yes... the ever popular and terribly expensive Red Ripe Tomato (under)glaze. Yep. It's a bitch to apply correctly. You should get a bunch of it, thin it, and then dip or spray your pieces. Plus it tends to burn out at stoneware temperatures. Good looking red if you can put up with the hassle, though.
However, the label warns of high Cadmium content and advises not to use for dinnerware. I feel like it should be OK if you use a good zinc free clear glaze....

At $22 a pint I think I'll just do without. The money I save can be used to build that dream kiln I've been working on which runs on recycled cooking oil. Man, those copper reds will be right on!!

[ This Message was edited by: Saint-Thomas on 2003-05-07 13:44 ]


 
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midnite
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Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 1230
From: 37? 47' N, 122? 26' W
Posted: 2003-05-07 1:46 pm   Permalink

To paraphrase the much overlooked Gerrit Graham (Jeff) in the way overlooked film classic "Used Cars":

Red Tiki mugs are bad luck.



midnite

I've told you a million times a rabbit's foot is no protection against a red car.


 
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Trader Woody
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 2301
From: Tiki Manor, Forest of Bowland,UK
Posted: 2003-05-07 2:26 pm   Permalink

Ah yes, the infamous Red Tiki mug tests of 1966. Thousands of mice were force-fed Mai Tai's via a red ceramic Tiki mug (with little straws poking out for each tiny vermin). Only one cigarette break for each 4 hour binge was allowed (Timed to coincide with the smoking beagles' Mai Tai break). Every single one of those bloated mice died from 'acute alcohol poisoning', but were observed to be wearing what was described as being "A big, sloppy grin". Those damn red mugs!

Trader Woody


 
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KokomoTikiBar&Grill
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 20, 2002
Posts: 429
From: KOKOMO, MISSISSIPPI
Posted: 2003-05-07 2:37 pm   Permalink

Some people worry to much. I say eat more RED meat, drink from leaded RED mugs and be RED-y to die from a semi running your RED ass over on the freeway while breathing that smoggy shit you call air.

I love Wild Animals, they taste great!


 
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purple jade
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 19, 2003
Posts: 1450
From: New Orleans
Posted: 2003-05-07 3:17 pm   Permalink

What an edifying, if not somewhat unsettling thread! So it seems only those who compulsively lick the outside of their mugs should be concerned with toxicity? Perhaps those Playtex disposable bottle liners should be used with questionably glazed mugs...and less air in baby's stomach means all that Lava Flow won't erupt all over the new carpet.

LaCroix, baby spew...LaCroix, baby spew...

[ This Message was edited by: purple jade on 2003-05-16 08:07 ]


 
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KokomoTikiBar&Grill
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 20, 2002
Posts: 429
From: KOKOMO, MISSISSIPPI
Posted: 2003-05-09 12:14 pm   Permalink

What part of Louisiana you from Purple Jade?

 
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purple jade
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Feb 19, 2003
Posts: 1450
From: New Orleans
Posted: 2003-05-09 12:22 pm   Permalink

I'm in the New Orleans area.

 
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