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Tiki Central Forums Tiki Drinks and Food Does boiling ruin simple syrup
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Does boiling ruin simple syrup
Dapuma1
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Joined: May 04, 2010
Posts: 113
Posted: 2010-05-07 8:52 pm   Permalink

I have seen do not boil the simple syrup when making it at home...left it on the stove and what do you know it boiled...just wondering if it is usable or not

 
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PiPhiRho
Grand Member (first year)  

Joined: Mar 25, 2002
Posts: 1020
From: Redondo Beach
Posted: 2010-05-07 9:05 pm   Permalink

In my opinion boiling ruins it. It burns the sugar. If it turns a dar color, then you have burned the sugar.


 
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Dapuma1
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Joined: May 04, 2010
Posts: 113
Posted: 2010-05-07 10:03 pm   Permalink

i put one cup of sugar and one cup of water and i have more than one cup of liquid...is that right?

2nd batch is pretty clear throughout and doesnt have much for particles...only when it was hot and on the stove and i stirred it could i see invididual particles

does that sound about right?


 
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Sparkle Mark
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Joined: Jul 05, 2004
Posts: 301
From: Porter Ranch, CA
Posted: 2010-05-07 11:58 pm   Permalink

Whether or not it's boiling is relative to your elevation.
Use a candy thermometer.
I will typically take a syrup up to boiling (just barely, and I'm pretty close to sea level) and then lower the heat and let it simmer right at temperature (just around 215F until I get the consistency that I like.
If you get it above 235F the sugar will begin to caramelize, this is good for candy, bad for syrup.
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lefthandedgoth
Member

Joined: May 07, 2010
Posts: 4
From: oooooooooooklahoma
Posted: 2010-05-08 04:05 am   Permalink

If it just boiled a moment or two, taste it. If it just tastes like simple syrup, you're fine. Otherwise, if it tastes kinda burned, um. Throw in some butterscotch candies and melt them, and use it for waffle syrup. Next batch -- don't boil.

I measure the water first, bring it to a simmer, and then dump it over the sugar in a thermal safe vessel. I also have a water dispenser that makes hot water for instant coffee, and if I'm particularly lazy and making a smallish batch of syrup for just a couple drinks, I'll use it instead. The sugar just needs to dissolve, not cook.

Although if you are making something particularly sweet a slightly caramelized sugar syrup might lend an interesting bitterness. But it wouldn't be kulturny -- so don't try to sneak it into a tiki fan's Mai Tai. We'll notice. Hm... maybe an Old Fashioned, a Whiskey Sour, or a bastard Hot Toddy... might go with the flavor of rye whiskey in particular, not the sweet blended canadian or --

sorry... this forum is for tiki drinks...


 
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Chip and Andy
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Joined: Jul 13, 2004
Posts: 2208
From: Corner table, Molokai Lounge, Mai-Kai.
Posted: 2010-05-08 06:08 am   Permalink

If your making bar (simple) syrup you don't even need the stove.

1 part water, 1 part sugar, shake vigorously until the sugar is dissolved. Done.

If your making Rock Candy syrup (2:1 or 3:1) then you need the heat to basically 'force' the sugar into the water. And it takes more heat to get there.

Boiling is not a bad thing and not something that should be feared. What you dont want to do is let it boil for very long**. Put the heat to it, bring it to a boil, turn the heat down and do the simmer thing until you get to where your going. The few minutes past your mark are not going to ruin your batch unless it is a very small batch.


** Unless your aiming for that caramel note in your syrup. Then you need to be a full boil for five to fifteen minutes and I highly suggest you use a thermometer to not go all the way to the candy stage.
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Martiki-bird
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Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 136
From: Blue Lory Lounge, NJ
Posted: 2010-05-08 07:12 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2010-05-07 22:03, Dapuma1 wrote:
i put one cup of sugar and one cup of water and i have more than one cup of liquid...is that right?

2nd batch is pretty clear throughout and doesnt have much for particles...only when it was hot and on the stove and i stirred it could i see invididual particles

does that sound about right?



One cup of sugar plus one cup of water equals approx. one and one half cups of Simple Syrup.

Sounds right. FYI, stirring helps speed up the breakdown of the sugar crystals into smaller particles by adding more friction (heat) to the process.



 
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Dapuma1
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Joined: May 04, 2010
Posts: 113
Posted: 2010-05-08 07:34 am   Permalink

i thought stirring helped disappate the heat due to it being released from the mixture (at least in reducing for cooking/baking that is how it works) so that is good to know

i kept stirring it hoping not to see any particles, however i could even after about 30-40 min of low constant heat so i let it cool and put it in the fridge overnight and it is a cohesive syrup now, cant see any particles which is good

it tastes like sugar water and when sloshed around the measuring cup it will coat the sides but move pretty freely at room tempurature (i left a little in the measuring cup overnight to see the consistancy at room temp)

does that sound about right for simple syrup?

Does the heating process work better than the cold process?

For rock syrup is 2-1 or 3-1 the right measure for the beachbum's books?

Thanks for the help everyone...first time making syrup


 
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Swanky
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Joined: Apr 03, 2002
Posts: 5051
From: Hapa Haole Hideaway, TN
Posted: 2010-05-10 09:36 am   Permalink

Shaking water and sugar will not make simple syrup. It will simply make sugar water and the sugar will turn back into sugar in the jar pretty soon.

You will need to get the water to boiling to break the sugar into its components and make a solution that is more sweet than actual sugar, and that will keep the sugar in suspension rather than precipitating out and forming that sugar crud in your jar.

The ideal way to do this and have it keep without precipiatating is to first, boil the water, add a drop or two of some acid, like lemon or lime juice, and add an equal amount of sugar in until the sugar is gone and reduce heat. Let this simmer at a low roil for 10-15 minutes. Then cool and bottle.

That little but of acid helps to keep the 2 components of sugar separated AND to keep them joined with the water so they do not precipitate out. You'll never taste the acid. That is inverted sugar, which is the same as simple syrup in taste and use, but far better in terms of shelf life.

The Bum uses the terms simple syrup, sugar syrup and rock candy syrup interchangably in his books.

Pouring the cold sugar in the boiling water will stop the boil (probably) and the heat will rise as you stir the sugar away. Once it is desolved, the chemical change is done as far as that high heat. You should not burn it unless you are boiling it a long time or making a large batch.
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Chip and Andy
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Joined: Jul 13, 2004
Posts: 2208
From: Corner table, Molokai Lounge, Mai-Kai.
Posted: 2010-05-10 10:48 am   Permalink

Quote:

On 2010-05-10 09:36, Swanky wrote:
The Bum uses the terms simple syrup, sugar syrup and rock candy syrup interchangably in his books.



Bar Syrup and Simple Syrup are basically the same and are typically 1:1 sugar and water (you can't get simpler than one to one!). Invert Sugar Syrup is more stable and will keep longer, and there are all kinds of ways to get there including a bit of lemon, lime, Karo, or salt.

Rock Candy syrup is different and should generally not be used unless called out in the recipe. Rock Candy Syrup is considerably sweeter and if your using it in place of Simple Syrup you'll need to adjust your recipe accordingly.

Check this:

http://www.tikiroom.com/tikicentral/bb/viewtopic.php?topic=25657&forum=10

For an excellent how-to and explanation of Simple Syrup and Rock Candy Syrup.


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The Gnomon
Grand Member (7 years)  

Joined: May 01, 2007
Posts: 1293
From: MD-DC-VA
Posted: 2010-05-10 12:55 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2010-05-07 20:52, Dapuma1 wrote:
I have seen do not boil the simple syrup when making it at home...left it on the stove and what do you know it boiled...just wondering if it is usable or not



This thread on making
rock candy syrup might give you some ideas.

You can boil the sugar, but you don't want to burn it, which requires lots of stirring. The more sugar you force into the solution, the higher its boiling point. RCS is not sweeter than simple syrup, but there is a ton more sugar in it. If you force enough sugar into the RCS, after it has cooled, rock candy crystals will begin to precipitate gradually on their own, or faster if you give them some help.


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Chip and Andy
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Joined: Jul 13, 2004
Posts: 2208
From: Corner table, Molokai Lounge, Mai-Kai.
Posted: 2010-05-10 1:10 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2010-05-10 12:55, The Gnomon wrote:
RCS is not sweeter than simple syrup, but there is a ton more sugar in it.



It is sweeter. Not the taste because more sugar still tastes like sugar. RCS is sweeter by its total volume of sugar in the same measure.

It is the same concept as Rum vs Overproof Rum. Lemon Hart 151 is still rum, but it has 75 percent alcohol so it is 'stronger.'

RCS is still just a sugar solution, but it has more sugar in the same volume. A 1:1 syrup would give you 50% sugar, a 4:1 RCS would give you 75% sugar in the same volume. If you were to use the same measure of RCS in your drink you would be getting more sweet in the finished drink.
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congawa
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Joined: Aug 11, 2008
Posts: 356
From: Long Beach, CA
Posted: 2010-05-10 2:22 pm   Permalink

I just made ginger syrup yesterday, and per the Bum's directions he instructs putting the 1:1 sugar:water and the sliced ginger all in a pan and then bringing it all to a boil, at which you reduce heat and simmer 2 minutes. So it would seem that the boiling is okay--just not for a length of time.

Personally, after making regular simple syrup a number of times, which--no matter how much care I take--results in a messy, sugary stove and countertop, then a syrup in the fridge I end up having to throw away in a few weeks after only using part of it (wasting a good part of a cup of sugar) I have found it much easier just to buy a bottle of Stirrings sugar syrup for $4.99 which keeps in the fridge (with preservatives) as long as I need it. I'm only making my own specialized syrups, i.e. cinnamon, ginger, etc.

By the way, I have heard of people adding a little rum/vodka/etc to syrup to make it preserve longer. However, how much alcohol can you add to, say, 2 cups of simple syrup before it stops becoming a syrup and instead becomes a failed liqueur?

Brent


 
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Chip and Andy
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Joined: Jul 13, 2004
Posts: 2208
From: Corner table, Molokai Lounge, Mai-Kai.
Posted: 2010-05-10 4:14 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2010-05-10 14:22, congawa wrote:
By the way, I have heard of people adding a little rum/vodka/etc to syrup to make it preserve longer. However, how much alcohol can you add to, say, 2 cups of simple syrup before it stops becoming a syrup and instead becomes a failed liqueur?

Brent



I have to give you a vague kind of answer and it involves some math....

To get your syrups up to a shelf-stable proof you have to add enough alcohol to get to at least 10% ABV, or 20 proof. Your best target is 15%ABV and with most home-brew you can get up to three months on the bar or up to nine months in the fridge. Every home-brew is different, some ingredients are just not compatible with storage while others will last longer than you.

For your two cups of syrup you should add 3 3/4 ounces of vodka. Make it easy and add 4 ounces and you should be OK.

And shelf stabilizing Sugar Syrup will NOT keep it from crystalizing. It will only keep it from growing. Well, it will slow down anything that may grow in there. Following Swanky's recipe for making Invert Sugar will last longest without crystalizing, every other method it is just a matter of time before your sugar syrup becomes sugar crystals again.


 
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Martiki-bird
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Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 136
From: Blue Lory Lounge, NJ
Posted: 2010-05-10 7:48 pm   Permalink

Adding a tiny bit of info to Chip's post:

The only way to keep high-volume sugar solutions (like RCS) from crystallizing is to add an emulsifier to the solution. The most common additive is "gum arabic". Gum Arabic is used "Gomme Syrup" (the only ingredients are sugar, water and gum arabic), which is once again available to purchase at some specialty stores. Gum arabic is a completely natural product: it is the hardened sap (like maple syrup) from the Acacia tree.

If you are thinking about making gomme syrup, it's kind of a pain. the general recipe is one part gum arabic powder dissolved in one part boiled water which you add to a solution of four parts sugar dissolved in 2 parts water. Boil the mixture at a low roll for about 2 minutes. There are recipes on the web, and you will find that many of the sugar proportions change based on personal preference. Me, I'm too lazy to make it...and just use simple syrup.

Cheers!
Gina


 
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