FEATURES | MUSIC | BOOKS | DRINKS | FORUMS | GAMES | LINKS | ABOUT


advertise on Tiki Central

Celebrating classic and modern Polynesian Pop
  [Edit Profile]  [Edit Preferences]  [Search] [Sign Up]
[Personal Messages]  [Member List]  [Help/FAQ]  [Rules]  [Login]
Tiki Central Forums Ľ Ľ Collecting Tiki Ľ Ľ IMPORTANT: Spam in Collecting Tiki
Goto page ( 1 | 2 Next Page )
IMPORTANT: Spam in Collecting Tiki
hanford_lemoore
Proprietor

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1870
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2003-06-15 01:43 am   Permalink

This has come up a lot recently so I thought Iíd address it.

Thereís a been a lot of discussion about spam in the Collecting Tiki forum, and a lot of ribbing of people who post an auction or sale as their first post. In all but one case that I can remember, the announcer has left, often in a huff. So I want to clarify some things. First in a very simple form, then in a detail.

The basics:


  • Auction announcements are allowed in Collecting Tiki ,regardless of whoís posting it.
  • Be kind to people and judge them on their auction quality, not number of posts.


Announcing an eBbay auction for something that is truly Tiki-related is not Spam, no matter who the announcer is, or how many posts they have. Collecting Tiki is the appropriate forum for announcing it. The forum was started for exactly that reason.

Tiki Central is about the exchange of information. It was that way from the beginning and for a long time thatís all it really was. Making friends and becoming a real community came later. And announcing a Tiki ebay auction completely fits into the mission and model of Tiki Central. Iím not saying the friendship/community part isnít important, only that it shouldnít stand in the way of the information exchange.

If you take a look at
www.tikiroom.com Ďs homepage, youíll see I have a lot of Features geared at pretty basic tiki stuff. Thereís a reason for that: I was once a complete Tiki novice (and still am in many aspects) and just I wanted to tell other novices about the stuff I found. I had always wished there was a place for people who donít or canít spend hours at flea markets, antique stores, and whatnot.

I want Tiki Central to stay newbie-friendly. If someone new posts an auction, I ask that you please donít harass them simply because theyíre new. If the auction is overpriced or of horrible quality or is pseudo-tiki, definitely feel free to post about that, but be polite and stick to the facts, and assume theyíre new and arenít aware of their auctionís shortcomings. Youíre not only letting the newbie know politely, but youíre also informing (thousands of) other regulars who may not be aware of price/quality/genre issues. The benefit of this is simple: seasoned members can expose the auction for what it is (either good or bad) whether itís an honest newbie or a guy trying to make a quick buck; newer members reading will learn from the replies, and in the case the auction is posted by someone whoís truly into Tiki, then we havenít scared them away.

I am working on getting (A) better house rules for Collecting Tiki and getting them in a place that is easier to read, esp. for the newbies and (B) a ďSALEĒ option for new posts that make it easy for people to weed out auctions from other posts. Please bear with me until Iíve gotten that added.

Iím interested in what everyone has to say about this because the Spam issue is governed by emotion as much as it is logic. If Iíve missed something, let me know. If youíve never posted to Tiki Central, hereís an invite to voice yourself.

~Hanford
(and Mig)


 View Profile of hanford_lemoore Send a personal message to hanford_lemoore  Email hanford_lemoore Goto the website of hanford_lemoore     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
kctiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Apr 22, 2003
Posts: 439
From: Kansas City
Posted: 2003-06-15 2:40 pm   Permalink

I agree it's pretty cheesy when people ONLY use this site to try and sell their stuff to a target audience. However, if we're too draconian in trying to deter such practices, we could be throwing the baby out with the bath water.

Even within a tiki affinity group, there are varying tastes and budgets. A wise entrepenuer would stick around long enough to figure out what we want that we can't find.

It's great to have a place where we can let our hair down and just be ourselves. A lot more fun for everybody if we can do so without cramping other peoples' style.


 
View Profile of kctiki Send a personal message to kctiki  Email kctiki     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
twowheelin'tiki
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Nov 28, 2002
Posts: 712
From: santa monica
Posted: 2003-06-15 2:54 pm   Permalink

FREEDOM OF THE PRESS!

 
View Profile of twowheelin'tiki Send a personal message to twowheelin'tiki  Email twowheelin'tiki     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
hanford_lemoore
Proprietor

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1870
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2003-06-15 2:59 pm   Permalink

Quote:

On 2003-06-15 14:54, twowheelin'tiki wrote:
FREEDOM OF THE PRESS!



Can you expand on this a little? I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing with me ...

~Hanford


 
View Profile of hanford_lemoore Send a personal message to hanford_lemoore  Email hanford_lemoore Goto the website of hanford_lemoore     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Swanky
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Apr 03, 2002
Posts: 5047
From: Hapa Haole Hideaway, TN
Posted: 2003-06-15 4:33 pm   Permalink

I do think this area could be subdivided into "Ebay Auctions" which could even be deleted after they are a month old maybe. And maybe "Tiki Finds" and "Selling Tiki" or "Sales sites and resources" and "Wanted."

Collecting is about selling, trading, buying and even sharing.
_________________

Announcing Swank Pad and Crazy Al's Molokai Maiden!


 View Profile of Swanky Send a personal message to Swanky  Email Swanky Goto the website of Swanky     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
SugarCaddyDaddy
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Jun 03, 2002
Posts: 1500
From: Huntington Beach, California
Posted: 2003-06-15 5:04 pm   Permalink

Quote:

hanford_lemoore wrote:
In all but one case that I can remember, the announcer has left, often in a huff. So I want to clarify some things...



Perhaps we should give way to the thought that those that "left in a huff" were possibly/actually guilty of spamming. I personally believe that if they were truly & innocently putting something up for sale as their first post, and then so sensitive that (negative) responses to it drove them away, then it was just a matter of time before they got their feelings hurt another way. Let's face it, we do have some TC'ers that you have to get to know before learning about their humor. Also, we all don't have like opinions, so again, it would have been a matter of time before they came up against opposition on another subject. I tend to lean towards the fact that the 'accused' spammer was just trying to make a quick buck from an easy target = Tiki Central.

Quote:

hanford_lemoore wrote:
[*]Be kind to people and judge them on their auction quality, not number of posts.



Do you mean "quality" as in "presentation"? IF so, then on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being top score, I give a 1 for ONLY saying to the affect of "here's something you need to buy" or "check out this place for tiki stuff" or anything presented in that fashion. I give a 8/9 score for those saying who they are, what they like about tiki or what influenced them, and any additional non-selling information they offer. I give a 10 for including where they are actually from and an email address (just for added credibility of truly wanting to become part of the TC group).

Quote:

hanford_lemoore wrote:
Announcing an eBay auction for something that is truly Tiki-related is not Spam, no matter who the announcer is, or how many posts they have...



Ok, so let's say they have something tiki-related, for ME PERSONALLY, I believe a little introduction or at the very least a "Hello" or "Aloha" is what is nice to have, but not always received.

If I was at a TC gathering with my fellow TC friends, and out from behind comes a person we've never seen or met says "I've got this six-inch carved-from-lava tiki, who will give me $30 for it?", without so much as an introduction, I would honestly think that we would wonder and ask: "well, who are you? Where did you come from?" etc., before even considering purchasing that tiki. I believe it's just common courtesy for a proper introduction whether you meet someone in person or on-line.

Quote:

hanford_lemoore wrote:
If someone new posts an auction, I ask that you please donít harass them simply because theyíre new. If the auction is overpriced or of horrible quality or is pseudo-tiki, definitely feel free to post about that, but be polite and stick to the facts...The benefit of this is simple: seasoned members can expose the auction for what it is (either good or bad) whether itís an honest newbie or a guy trying to make a quick buck...



So what about those that cry "harassment" even if it's a seasoned member who exposes an auction for what it is? This may be a neverending circle.

My
previously expressed thoughts of pre-qualifying new members still stands strong in my mind.

Thanks, Hanford, for letting express my views on the subject.
_________________


 View Profile of SugarCaddyDaddy Send a personal message to SugarCaddyDaddy      Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Basement Kahuna
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 3591
From: Jawja Province, Isle of North America
Posted: 2003-06-15 6:54 pm   Permalink

You know, if I wanted the damned tiki for 30.00, I'd just buy it regardless of the deeper meaning of the whole thing. I'm happy to see the stuff for sale in one place, personally, and would love to look at more of it every day.

 
View Profile of Basement Kahuna Send a personal message to Basement Kahuna  Email Basement Kahuna     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Humuhumu
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Aug 22, 2002
Posts: 3623
From: San Francisco
Posted: 2003-06-15 7:23 pm   Permalink

If someone just pops in to sell something without being social, they're doing themselves a disservice since their item won't get as much attention, but they aren't really hurting us, since it's so easy to ignore them. I don't see a compelling reason to try to filter these folks out -- if we just ignore them, their boring posts will float naturally to the bottom of the list, anyhow.

Plus, it's better to know too much about what's available on the tiki market than too little; it's not as if these folks are trying to pitch non-tiki stuff to us. Since we began this spam dialogue in earnest (it has been a good one, btw), multiple folks have piped up to say they enjoy seeing these posts. Hell, I even thought the "Fishy" panties were worth seeing, just because they were so ludicrous.

Bottom line: some people like these posts, so let them be. If you don't like them, the course to take is simple: ignore them.

_________________

Critiki - Ooga-Mooga - Humu Kon Tiki


 View Profile of Humuhumu Send a personal message to Humuhumu  Email Humuhumu Goto the website of Humuhumu     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Basement Kahuna
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 3591
From: Jawja Province, Isle of North America
Posted: 2003-06-15 9:10 pm   Permalink

Amen, sista Humu.

 
View Profile of Basement Kahuna Send a personal message to Basement Kahuna  Email Basement Kahuna     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
hanford_lemoore
Proprietor

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1870
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2003-06-15 9:54 pm   Permalink

Thanks everyone for the replies, keep them coming.

SCD, I understand your feelings on this. Iím not asking anyone to change their opinion on posts like this. Iím only asking that we stick more to the facts and be polite to any new visitor.

SCD wrote:
Quote:

Perhaps we should give way to the thought that those that "left in a huff" were possibly/actually guilty of spamming.



Itís not spamming if itís tiki-related. This is a Tiki Collecting forum. If theyíre posting a Tiki collectable for sale, then it simply isnít spamming. This is probably why most people leave in a huff: theyíre confused as to why an informative, on-topic post is being rejected.

Quote:
I tend to lean towards the fact that the 'accused' spammer was just trying to make a quick buck from an easy target = Tiki Central.



I donít understand how this is bad. If the auction is a great value, then youíre going to welcome this Ďspammerí Ė I donít think anyone would have had a problem with the Shag seller if s/he were selling each print for 75 bucks. If itís a bad value, experienced members should post and let others know, politely. Therefore, the only money this Ďspammerí is going to make is a fair value Ö theyíre not going to be able to rip anyone off. And everyone wins: Some Tiki Central member gets a cool tiki thing for a good price, and the seller is able to sell their item. Once the auction is over, theyíll either never post again, or theyíll post more (auctions or otherwise), therefore becoming a regular.

Quote:
I believe it's just common courtesy for a proper introduction whether you meet someone in person or on-line.



I agree. And I think that itís common courtesy that weíre polite to people even if they donít introduce themselves to our satisfaction. Remember: introductions can be made by either party. Not everyone is going to view Tiki Central as a social setting at first. Newbies make mistakes Ė thatís a fact of life. Letís go easy on them.

But Iím not sure I fully understand this aspect of the reaction to ďspamĒ, because new members jump in all the time in other (non-auction) forums/posts without introducing themselves, and they donít get the cold shoulder there. Is it simply the fact that theyíre trying to sell something?

Quote:
So what about those that cry "harassment" even if it's a seasoned member who exposes an auction for what it is? This may be a neverending circle.



All we can do it try. Thatís all Iím asking. We can try to be polite and stick to the facts when critiquing an auction. If they cry harassment anyway (the hoity toity girl seemed pretty high-strung in the regard) then at least we tried. Thatís all we can do.

I want to point out that Iím trying to fix both sides of the issues. Last night I made changes to the ďNew TopicĒ feature for Collecting Tiki (test it out by clicking the New Topic button and then seeing the new options). It asks you to read the rules, and it provides an easy way for people to flag their posts as eBay auctions. Itís my hope that more members (both new and longtime) will read and abide by the rules.

Thanks for reading,

~Hanford




[ This Message was edited by: hanford_lemoore on 2003-06-16 02:09 ]


 
View Profile of hanford_lemoore Send a personal message to hanford_lemoore  Email hanford_lemoore Goto the website of hanford_lemoore     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Swanky
Tiki Socialite

Joined: Apr 03, 2002
Posts: 5047
From: Hapa Haole Hideaway, TN
Posted: 2003-06-16 09:51 am   Permalink

I think it's a really wrong way to think that everyone who posts an item for sale must also be a part of the social scene here or give us some bio. That's just wrong.

There a re a lot of people who never, or rarely post, but they read. A person could have been reading this site for months and have a great item to sell. They are just not for this way of communicating. Should we make them feel bad about that? No.

If all the member os TIki Central posted a lot, we'd be swamped!
_________________

Announcing Swank Pad and Crazy Al's Molokai Maiden!


 View Profile of Swanky Send a personal message to Swanky  Email Swanky Goto the website of Swanky     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
KokomoTikiBar&Grill
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 20, 2002
Posts: 429
From: KOKOMO, MISSISSIPPI
Posted: 2003-06-16 10:00 am   Permalink

I think SugarCaddy should join http://www.tikimug.com and talk to everyone there about it and see what they think.


JUST KIDDING!

[ This Message was edited by: KokomoTikiBar&Grill on 2003-06-16 14:23 ]


 View Profile of KokomoTikiBar&Grill Send a personal message to KokomoTikiBar&Grill      Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
hanford_lemoore
Proprietor

Joined: Mar 23, 2002
Posts: 1870
From: Tiki Central
Posted: 2003-06-16 2:18 pm   Permalink

Hey now, SCD's just voicing his opinion, and that's great. I understand how he feels because from time to tim a post here will just bug me, and it's an emotional thing. It's not about right or wrong, it's not about the logic of it, it's just the damn post bugs me! And if that's the way someone feels about these "spam" posts, then no amount of guidelines or suggestions are going to change that.

But that's why I say I'm not asking anyone to change their opinions on it, just their public reactions.

If it means we have to give a little bit in this area to make it a better place for new members (and old members), then I think it's worth it.

Thanks for everyone's comments.

~Hanford

[ This Message was edited by: hanford_lemoore on 2003-06-16 22:22 ]


 
View Profile of hanford_lemoore Send a personal message to hanford_lemoore  Email hanford_lemoore Goto the website of hanford_lemoore     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
KokomoTikiBar&Grill
Tiki Socialite

Joined: May 20, 2002
Posts: 429
From: KOKOMO, MISSISSIPPI
Posted: 2003-06-16 2:22 pm   Permalink

I found humor in my post, you did not? I better put in my "JUST KIDDING"

 
View Profile of KokomoTikiBar&Grill Send a personal message to KokomoTikiBar&Grill      Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
MonkeyPaw
Tiki Centralite

Joined: May 26, 2003
Posts: 59
From: Reno
Posted: 2003-06-16 3:26 pm   Permalink

Thank you Hanford! I feel the same way you do. I was not too happy with how people responded with my 1st post. I thought I was going to be dealing with a bunch a Tiki Snobs.. I was insulted because respectfully I did read and follow the instructions on posting an ebay auction. However.. after some communication.. everything turned out to be great! Im happy I stuck around. I use this site now more than ever.
Loving Monkeypaw

[ This Message was edited by: MonkeyPaw on 2003-06-16 15:27 ]


 
View Profile of MonkeyPaw Send a personal message to MonkeyPaw  Email MonkeyPaw     Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Goto page ( 1 | 2 Next Page )
U-Moderate:
  
v1.5

[ About Tiki Central | Contact Tiki Central | Advertise on Tiki Central ]
(c) 2000-2014 Tikiroom.com (tm), Tiki Central (tm)

Credits & copyright infomation